The Trump administration’s apparent planning for a potential regime change in Venezuela is inseparable from that country’s economy. The U.S. government claims that Nicolás Maduro’s regime has become a narcostate, relying on the production and export of drugs to stay afloat. What’s clear is that Venezuela’s traditional reliance on oil revenue has come undone—and that the United States has itself played a role in that development.

The Trump administration’s apparent planning for a potential regime change in Venezuela is inseparable from that country’s economy. The U.S. government claims that Nicolás Maduro’s regime has become a narcostate, relying on the production and export of drugs to stay afloat. What’s clear is that Venezuela’s traditional reliance on oil revenue has come undone—and that the United States has itself played a role in that development.

Has oil always defined the Venezuelan economy? What accounts for the precipitous fall in Venezuela’s living standards in the past decade? What role do drug cartels play in Venezuela?

Those are just a few of the questions that came up in my recent conversation with FP economics columnist Adam Tooze on the podcast we co-host, Ones and Tooze. What follows is an excerpt, edited for length and clarity. For the full conversation, look for Ones and Tooze wherever you get your podcasts.